Finding Fault

I've been offline and off-television most of the day, so I really don't know how the blame game is shaping up - things change so fast that the conventional wisdom yesterday is a tired-out meme today.

When we discuss responsibility for the present situation, what are we talking about exactly? Not the hurricane, itself, for that is beyond our control. The destruction? Not exactly, although there's some of that: the strength of the levees, the wisdom of building on the coast and the incentives for doing so - those are part of the human element in this tragedy.

No, what we're talking about is the impact of the destruction on human beings: who was affected, in what ways and how seriously. The arguments seem to be falling into three areas:

1)Evacuation

2)In relation to New Orleans, the security of the city in the aftermath

3)Recovery efforts

There are many points to be made and really, countless failures - which are still continuing as we speak. Even with the terrible scope of this particular storm and the unique geography of the New Orleans area which makes evacuation a challenge, there were terrible misjudgments, it's clear. And whether anyone can be honest about these failures and if any heads will roll...will be something to see. I doubt it will be seen, however. The inability to get supplies into folks at the Superdome and at the Convention Center, and the inability to get them out sooner will continue to boggle the mind - I mean...if Shepherd Smith can get in there, why couldn't ....oh, never mind. It just makes my brain hurt.

However, one thing that I thought about a lot today was a quite simple question: could it have been otherwise? More bluntly, what provisions do  the emergency and evacuation plans for large urban areas make for those, especially the poor, the elderly and the ill who don't have access to personal transportation? We've all seen the photos of the submerged buses, ( Basic blogpost intro to the problem here)and the question has loomed large in my mind, "What about those who can't self-evacuate?" I really have been wondering if these plans just write them off as acceptable and unavoidable losses.

This cached document from Loyola U indicates that the city did, supposedly contract with bus companies to evacuate residents of nursing homes, etc. But weatherblogger Jeff Masters has a lengthy post here that points out the difficulties of whatever plan existed. And really, I am left wondering if, in the realities of these plans, if those who can't self-evacuate are simply written off in the final calculation. Are they?

Comments

[mark t-k]

I know I'm going to come off here as very hard-hearted, but I think it's important to examine our premises here. There has never been a time in history when government -- any government -- was expected to ensure the safety of all its people against natural disasters, especially ones of this magnitude. To expect there to be an airtight plan to evacuate everyone rapidly from a large metropolitan area is simply unrealistic and unreasonable. We have certain risks as human beings on planet earth, and one of them is that we might die in natural disaster. That risk is phenomenally magnified for the infirm, the wheelchair-bound, and the extremely poverty stricken. In an ideal world, would there be a thorough plan that had the forethought *and* fully accessible resources to save everyone? Sure. But this is far from an ideal world. And nothing short of perfect planning and near-infinite resources could save everyone in a situation where virtually the entire infrastructure has been destroyed. The U.S. does not function on the idea that government will save us from everything; if that's the country and form of government we want, then we'd better be ready to give over a whole lot more in taxes to an exceptionally paternal Uncle Sam to massively bolster its rescue and planning resources.

(none of the above should presuppose I don't feel bad about those caught in this thing; I feel awful for them.)

[michigancatholic]

There was a mandatory evacuation order. Buses were arranged for people to leave before the storm, in addition. There were three days for people to hitchhike, ride, walk out. We were watching here in Michigan in disbelief at the complacency of it all. The majority of people did get into their cars and get out. But there were some who didn't, and no one really knows why.

I'm sure there were some who couldn't leave because of age, health, hospitalization, etc. But those aren't the ones I've been seeing on CNN, who have looked able-bodied enough to me, for the most part--at least able-bodied enough to participate in street demonstrations and lots of mischief. Lots of "do this for me" and not much "let us work together."

Not only that, while watching CNN, during all that "no-water" talk there were people frequently calmly drinking bottled water on camera. I mean, I hate to be picky, but I was hearing one thing and seeing another at the same time......

The most dismaying thing about it all was not federal delay. It takes time to get people there AND the whole south was hit--Alabama, Mississippi....Rather, it was the social breakdown that occurred, and the fact that a criminal spree held up rescue for TWO WHOLE DAYS!! These animals were storming hospitals for drugs. The feds had to bring in sharp-shooters so that rescues and medical aid could resume. Pathetic.

I'm glad the Feds went in. They're doing a good job.

[Michael]

The U.S. does not function on the idea that government will save us from everything....

Nice straw man. The US does function on the idea that the US government will perform well the function that people wanted it to perform this week. Under Clinton or Gore, it would have; under Bush, it simply didn't, and calling attention to that point is the duty of good Americans.

[michigancatholic]

BTW, I feel sorry for most of them--especially those who really are invalids and hospitalized and little kids.

But I'm really angry that there are people who will have died in their attics because the rescuers couldn't get through because they were being shot at by lawless idiots.

I'm really angry that several police officers were shot in the line of duty, most of them were shot at and they were so oppressed that rescues were held up. Several cops have committed suicide from the stress, I'll have you know. And all because hoodlums weren't dealt with locally fast enough.

I'm glad the federal government brought in some pros and are cleaning up the area, crime-wise. NOW perhaps they can get out there and use what little precious time they have to save some more people before they TOO die.

I'm really angry that we've had the race thing shoved in our face instead of real coverage of the WHOLE area. Mississippi and Alabama were hit too!!

[George]

I think it is fair to say the disaster has seriously impacted everyone it has touched, many more than the "infirm, the wheelchair-bound, and the extremely poverty stricken." Entire counties, rich and poor alike, have been evacuated, and their citizens are spread throughout the central U.S. tonight.

The issue is this. There has been no organized response from the federal government, with the major exception of the military. FEMA might as well not exist. So if a disaster occurs that is beyond the scope of a state response, you are out-of-luck in the USA, unless the DoD is prepared to move in.

That has been a shock to me, and I know a fair amount about disaster response. The U.S. response to the tsunami in India, Indonesia and Sri Lanka was more immediate that in our country, because DoD and USAID knew they were expected to pitch in.

If the pathetic excuse of FEMA is the $444 million annual budget for natural disasters (down approx. 1/3 since the administration's first budget in 2002) is not enough to have a credible plan, well that is simple B.S.

And the handwringing about limited government and that it can't do "everything" is callous and stupid. Government in the U.S is a huge business, taking nearly 40% of your tax dollars and GDP. By some estimates, the U.S. spends as much as the REST of world combined on military programs. And there are more than 2 million men and women in prison--nearly 4% of American males now spend their days and nights in jail. We have more convicts in total and per capita than any other country, and we execute more criminals per capita than every other country.

We support public services at every level of government, which includes city, county, state and federal in my area. If you add the cost of health care to our tax bills (which is what an employer does), our costs associated with government and health care are as high as Europe and Japan. We spend more on the military and prisons and on health care, and have lower taxes on rich people. So it looks like we have limited government if you live in Lousiana, but we really don't.

Instead we have a big fat montrosity that doesn't deliver what it promises and is currently being run by a gang of liars. It will be interesting to see if this matters to anyone, or we just shrug, once again.

[Andrea Harris]

Uh, Michael, the only "straw man" is coming from you. But anyone who reads your comment can see that.

[dilys]

As a lawyer, the point I keep coming up against is that even mandatory evacuation (w/out guns and martial law, or even then) is an uphill battle requiring hordes of personnel to cajole and wrestle people into buses against their will. And imagine one or more false alarms, and the complaints. It's sort of like some of the AIDS scenarios: and just who never heard the warnings?

If anyone "wrote them off," it was whoever didn't lift a phone to use the platoons of buses, the ones who didn't do real rehearsals once a year.

In fact, in emergency planning, there is always an "acceptable" -- horrible as that sounds -- toll. It needs to be as low as possible (not like this); but 100% is not contemplated, because perfectionism can scuttle practicality; and God gave humans good sense and a will to live to try to arrange it not be them or theirs so they'd lift a finger or two to Get Out of Dodge. There is only One Shepherd that scours the hillsides for the 1 out of 100, and He's not a pol.

This event has surfaced horrible dysfunction in many areas, somnolence, corruption, ignorance, and sickening confusion; but I think it's really unacceptable to anywhere near suggest that "they" "wrote them off" in a way that we holier bystanders wouldn't have.

[michigancatholic]

That's simply not true, George. Do you think that only New Orleans was hit? Do you think that there are thousands of fully dressed people sitting somewhere in a tunnel in Wash DC waiting for every mishap? I assure you that's not the case. It can't be. The country's too big.

The first lines of defense are the parishes, counties, cities and states. In NO, these lines failed miserably--abysmally. Their communication with each other was so poor that every level operated independently. It was terrible. When the levees broke, no one knew what was being done about it and they simply gave up. When gang warfare finally broke out and everything came to a screeching halt, no-one wanted to make a decision and empower the cops to do what needed to be done. Meantime, people were dying and no one was doing anything about it, but listening to the people in the superdome whine and b***ch.

Not only that, but it's in the laws that the Feds can't just come in without request from the governor which wasn't given right away. I heard her muling and puking and guessing--for a couple of days.

It wasn't until the Feds came in that it all turned around. When they came, they started to mop it up right away. They defined a plan, rules of engagement and started getting something done.

I will assure you that every single local unit of government that I know of here is in the same condition. WE HAVE NO ORGANIZED CIVIL DEFENSE IN THIS COUNTRY. If something happens it will be every man for himself for a couple of days til they can get the equipment here. That is, until they learn how to beam them up like Star Wars.....

Do we need a citizen civil defense? Yes we do. I have no idea how that gets started again.

[Boniface McInnes]

Under Clinton or Gore it would have? I guess we now know what some folks think of John Kerry's ability.

Now, I am as willing as anyone to believe that Clinton, or Gore, or Kerry would have been willing to overstep the bounds of the federal government and attempt to force the evacuation, at gun point, of a region the size of Great Britian, without any request for such from the duly elected governments of the States involved. That does seem in keeping with their ideals of what government should be. I just find it laughable that they'd have succeeded.

A duty of Good Americans, indeed!

Mark t-k makes a very good point. Mass Forced Evacuation, on a moment's notice and accomplished within 12 hours, is a dangerous task to charge to the federal government. It is a ridiculous task to expect of state government. It is simply beyond the means of local government.

And it is a task not fit for a free people, using either a catholic or an american notion of freedom. Imagine the uproar we'd hear if entire cities actually had to do a Mass Evac Drills on an annual basis. Americans gripe about jury duty, imagine the response to this.

No, if the fault lies with anyone, it lies with those who left the area with empty seats in their vehicles, and those who did choose not to leave until it was too late. Those who knew no one who might need a ride and those did nothing to seek one. Those who did not love the poor and those who loved their precious city more than themselves.

There's your culprits.

[Boniface McInnes]

michigancatholic,

He'll have to speak for himself, but if I understood George, he seems to be complaining that Government claims it can protect us from anything, including nature itself (knowing full well this is a tissue of lies) and expects, in return, a huge tax burden be borne by the populace.

That seems a reasonable position. People obviously believe government can save them from the brutality of sheer natural force; they did not birth this idea themselves or whip it up out of whole cloth. They expect it because it has been promised.

Promised by those who know they can never deliver.

[Boniface McInnes]

Ok, in fairness, I guess some in government might even be deluded enough to believe they can. If it has been an honest mistake, I await their declaration of repudiation of such promises, having learned their lesson, at the cost of a few thousand lives.

[SAHMmy]

michigancatholic is right George. FEMA can't do squat until the state governor sends out the request for federal assistance, and she did not do that until Wednesday, I think. She didn't even declare a state of emergency until AFTER Bush did!

The reason it SEEMED to take so long was because nobody expected the New Orleans Police Department to crumble as quickly as it did, which really REALLY complicated things for the rescuers, and everything had to kind of go on hiatus until the city could be secured by the military. That could only happen with Gov. Blanco requested it and as soon as she did everyone beat feet to get to the disaster area and enact a doable plan, which they have.

I know it's quite vogue currently to try to blame the whole thing on FEMA, but it just don't wash because of the legal restraints placed on the federal government to be ASKED to enter the situation. They just can't stomp all over the state and local jurisdictions. We got laws against that, son!

[Katherine]

I can't find any reports of buses out of the city, as opposed to the Superdome, in significant numbers before the storm. I've looked, after hearing rumors, and I just don't see them. If there is an article I am missing could someone please provide a cite? Thanks.

OTOH, there are reports that:
--the exact same failure to get the poor, carless, old, sick etc. out occurred before the last hurricane.
--it was also predicted by the Times Picayune's 2002 series.
--it was also predicted in the mock hurricane exercises they did.
--they were filming public service announcements telling people who didn't have cars, basically: find a neighbor to take you, because we can't afford buses. There is a newspaper article I can dig up about this from June 2002.

To get an idea of who is left behind I strongly, once again, recommend these firsthand accounts in the Times-Picayune. They are the poor, the old, the sick, and the caregivers of the latter two. People who were poor but relatively able bodied seem to have gone to the Convention Center; people who old or sick as well as poor are the ones who seem most likely to be left in even less safe places--houses, hospitals, nursing homes.

I would guess there is no evacuation plan that can get everyone out. Not with the short notice, and as many people in ill health as they were.

That there was virtually no effort at all, though--that they actually closed the bus depot and the airport before the evacuation order--is inexcusable. New Orleans needed an evacuation plan more than any other city in the United States. People have known that the city's complete destruction in a major hurricane was possible for years. Years and years and years. The bowl could have actually filled up faster than it did, if this were a Category 5 when it hit instead of a hit from the weak quadrant of a Category 4.

I'm not sure there's any other city in America that faced such a realistic doomsday--and in the other fairly realistic doomsdays, like giant earthquakes on the Pacific Coasts or nuclear weapons in Washington or New York, you have no warning. You just can't get people out before disaster strikes. And after--in the New York area there are 9 million people living on islands. Including some incredibly densely populated islands. San Francisco is much larger and denser than New Orleans, and earthquakes will tear apart the highways. I'm not sure you can evacuate those places even with a car, no matter what plan you have.

Whereas in New Orleans, it could have made an enormous difference. It wouldn't have been that cheap--a good, realistic evacuation plan would have cost a fair bit, but really, just not that much, considering the size of the homeland security budget. If it was financially unviable for the city there is no way it should have been for the federal government. When I think of the the bridge to nowhere in Alaska, the huge amounts of money protecting Wyoming and Idaho from terrorist attack....a bunch of buses? That's cheap. It's real cheap. It's a whole lot less expensive than the extra search and rescue efforts are going to cost.

The "do we really want the government storming people's homes at gunpoint" arguments are pretty ridiculous, as there is an awful lot of daylight between raiding nursing homes with AK-47s and not providing any damn buses or issuing the evac order before the bus depot and airport close.

As far as the looting, some of it was utterly shameful and despicable, some of it understandable (e.g. taking necessities for life), some of it just dumb, dumb dumb. But it was entirely foreseeable. For goodness sake, you get small scale destruction after sporting events. When you add in a situation where there is simply no order, and where some people are genuinely doing this to survive, in a city with the highest murder rate in America, it is entirely foreseeable. And it was surely not the looting that delayed the National Guard. Have you noticed the large weapons those guys carry?

As far as kvetching about the press coverage, give. me. a. break. FEMA was not aware of the situation of the convention center. They were made aware of the situation, only because CNN, MSNBC, FOX News, NPR, AND ABC, in a clutch tag-team effort, beat them over the head with it for 24 hours and finally, finally, the message sunk in. There is very little doubt that this saved some people's lives. Believe me, the press does NOT do this often. So I don't really care if it made George Bush look bad.

As far as the Blanco/Bush thing, you guys are repeating false information based on newspaper reports that have been retracted. They are ideologically convenient, but false. I'm sure there are plenty of legit things to criticize Blanco and Nagin for and otherwise exonerate Your Hero, but this is not one of them. This comes from a Washington Post report sourced by an anonymous official, that has since been contradicted by government documents and retracted by the post.

[michigancatholic]

Katherine, don't conflate taking a few groceries in an emergency AND storming a hospital for narcotics while shooting at the police. They're two completely different activities.

Thugs were even shooting at the rescue helicopters til the Feds stopped them, so don't give me that nonsense.

And we're not talking about a convention center here. We're talking about the Superdome and everyone was aware of that since last Sunday.

[Katherine]

here's a post with links to some of the docs on a state of emergency.

Here's a September 2004 article on who got left behind during the Ivan evacuation.

Here's the part of the 2002 series predicting that 100,000 will be left behind.

And here's a July article from this year predicting the same thing:

In storm, N.O. wants no one left behind; Number of people without cars makes evacuation difficult", Bruce Nolan, New Orleans Times Picayune, July 24, 2005. City, state and federal emergency officials are preparing to give the poorest of New Orleans' poor a historically blunt message: In the event of a major hurricane, you're on your own.

In scripted appearances being recorded now, officials such as Mayor Ray Nagin, local Red Cross Executive Director Kay Wilkins and City Council President Oliver Thomas drive home the word that the city does not have the resources to move out of harm's way an estimated 134,000 people without transportation.

In the video, made by the anti-poverty agency Total Community Action, they urge those people to make arrangements now by finding their own ways to leave the city in the event of an evacuation.

"You're responsible for your safety, and you should be responsible for the person next to you," Wilkins said in an interview. "If you have some room to get that person out of town, the Red Cross will have a space for that person outside the area. We can help you.

"But we don't have the transportation."

Officials are recording the evacuation message even as recent research by the University of New Orleans indicated that as many as 60 percent of the residents of most southeast Louisiana parishes would remain in their homes in the event of a Category 3 hurricane.

Their message will be distributed on hundreds of DVDs across the city. The DVDs' basic get-out-of-town message applies to all audiences, but the it is especially targeted to scores of churches and other groups heavily concentrated in Central City and other vulnerable, low-income neighborhoods, said the Rev. Marshall Truehill, head of Total Community Action.

"The primary message is that each person is primarily responsible for themselves, for their own family and friends," Truehill said.

In addition to the plea from Nagin, Thomas and Wilkins, video exhortations to make evacuation plans come from representatives of State Police and the National Weather Service, and from local officials such as Sen. Ann Duplessis, D-New Orleans, and State Rep. Arthur Morrell, D-New Orleans, said Allan Katz, whose advertising company is coordinating officials' scripts and doing the recording.

The speakers explain what to bring and what to leave behind. They advise viewers to bring personal medicines and critical legal documents, and tell them how to create a family communication plan. Even a representative of the Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals weighs in with a message on how to make the best arrangements for pets left behind.

Production likely will continue through August. Officials want to get the DVDs into the hands of pastors and community leaders as hurricane season reaches its height in September, Katz said.

I don't believe they ever got a chance to distribute them.

[Katherine]

"Katherine, don't conflate taking a few groceries in an emergency AND storming a hospital for narcotics while shooting at the police. They're two completely different activities.

Thugs were even shooting at the rescue helicopters til the Feds stopped them, so don't give me that nonsense."

Right, that's why I distinguished between looting that was understandable and some of the utter, depraved violence we saw. I am saying that it was foreseeable--or at least a lot of it was--and it is a reason the National Guard had to be there sooner, not a good explanation for delay. The police department did not have the capacity.

As far as the Superdome/Convention Center, Amy mentioned both and I assumed your problems with the news coverage related to both. Apparently not, but in any case, the convention center coverage makes up for a LOT in my book.

[michigancatholic]

No, the violence took everyone in government by surprise. It's the kind of thing that no one wants to admit happens among "civilized people." By and large, it didn't happen at 9-11 because the scenario was different.

No one expected thugs to start shooting at rescue motorboats. No one expected hoodlums to start storming hospitals to steal the drugs. No one expected that rescue efforts would have to be suspended til the Federal government brought in sharpshooters.

But that's what happened.

[michigancatholic]

Moreover, there were thousands of people in attics and homes who needed to be rescued and they sat and waited while all this went on. We haven't seen the death count yet, but it will be higher because of all this violence & the delay it caused.

[Katherine]

"We haven't seen the death count yet, but it will be higher because of all this violence & the delay it caused."

no question about that. I remember at one point they were projecting 15-20,000 shortly after 9/11, so I hope they're overshooting by that much here, too. But I don't really believe it.

[Rivendell]

To me, the human tragedy of this event boils down to one thing - poor planning, all across the board by almost everyone in positions of leadership. Local, state and federal, including Congress. Couple that with the stark realities of how some people behave whenever disaster strikes, and you get a perfect recipe for a hell on earth. Neglect, complacency and indifference on the part of many individuals contributed to the horrors we saw this week. Everyone knew for a long time what would befall New Orleans if the mother of all hurricanes hit. And yet despite all the warnings, a mock hurricane study done, past attempts to appropriate funds for the levee system from Congress, etc., etc., NOTHING was accomplished. Add on mistakes, misjudgments, mistiming, and just plain lack of common sense. The mayor of New Orleans and the Governor of Louisiana must carry a good chunk of the responsibility for what happened. And Congress for a long time did not take seriously the unique topographical characteristics that New Orleans presented and the real need to shore up that city’s defenses against natural disasters. So many became complacent because the Big Easy kept dodging the bullet. When the bullet finally ripped home, so many suffered and died because of ill-preparedness on the part of the government agencies charged with dealing in such disasters. Because of past hurricanes and studies/reports, they already knew that there would be people who would stubbornly refuse to leave and people who wouldn’t be able to leave for various reasons, not because they didn’t want to but because they couldn’t. There was plenty of time beforehand for intelligent and creative experts to think up and implement a workable plan to help the poor, sick, elderly, children, hospital-bound, etc. out of the city in a timely and orderly manner. These experts are paid good money to come up with ideas, that’s what they’re supposed to do. To just abandon all these people to face a category 4 hurricane naked and helpless is absolutely downright criminal. And as for the possibility of violent armed thugs roaming the streets and creating havoc, contingencies should have been made for that eventuality too. That’s what you have the National Guard for. The Governor should have known that given the NO police force would be stretched thin, looting, shootings, arsons and rapes could occur once she knew that Katrina was heading straight for her city and if she couldn’t fathom that possibility, then someone in her office should have made her aware and get her to call out for strong Guard presence in the city BEFORE the hurricane came ashore. Once the hurricane passed, the troops would have been in place in the streets ready to quell any trouble before it brewed out of control. You just can’t have lawlessness and chaos take over a major urban center, there is just no excuse for that. This is not Monday morning quarter-backing, this is all common sense thinking that should have been clear to the authorities, they all knew this would happen. Again, these people are appointed leaders because they're supposed to have the expertise, knowledge and the will to properly deal with events like a natural disaster, at least one would think! Not let everything disintegrate into a complete and deadly mess and not expect that people are going to ask hard questions and eventually hold them responsible for their incompetence.

[Todd]

The feds are most to blame, and I think the blame will stick. They've shown, at least in this administration, that the poor, the ill, and the elderly, are indeed acceptable losses. I can't imagine their disaster scenarios for a terrorist hit stateside are played out otherwise. Morally, that's just unacceptable for a Christian.

On that point, the Bush Administration has shown clearly that they're unprepared for disaster, and that will require substantial effort to correct, at least in the public's perception, if not in reality.

We can hope that this will spurn local governments to implement something substantial to get emergency planning rolling, but the reality is that we live in a large country with substantial resources that need to be coordinated. One mayor can't just call up another mayor three hundred miles away and make dinner and housing reservations for a few thousand.

We have clear indications the feds sat on resources and were in as much denial about the storm result as some of the able-bodied non-evacuees. Political appointees were naive and ineffective about their jobs, the FEMA head in particular. The president fumbled very, very badly in his first public statements, and quite frankly, has a lot to answer for. Anyone who thinks otherwise probably already has an evacuation route planned out. And other plans in the cooker, even if they're not going public with serious doubts about federal leadership in this country.

[Frank Gibbons]

Hey, just blame everything on George Bush. He's rich. He's Republican. He's dumb.

[Todd]

Frank, his wealth, politics, and lack of intelligence are irrelevant. He didn't do his job.

[al]

I think the real incompetent will turn out to be Chertoff and possibly Brown.

Mayor Nagin said that one of the first things President Bush said to him when he landed was that he only wanted to talk to people on the ground, because he was evidently getting bad information. This comes on the heels of Chertoff's infamous performance on NPR where he attempted to say to Robert Siegel that the reports Siegel was getting from his reporter about the Convention center, a reporter who was on the other line at the time, were hearsay or exxagerated.

Chertoff has gone on to say that the delay in getting the troops to the coast was due to the fact that "helipcopters can't fly in Hurricanes" and then yesterday on Meet the Press, confirmed that he was "husbanding" resources for other situations.

That seems to strongly suggest that Homeland Security, or FEMA made a conscious decision not to do exactly what Bush did when he took personal control of the situation, that is, to send in all available units immediately.

[Julia]

Point #1 My physician brother is part of the group that does state disaster planning for the state of New Mexico. He carries no brief for Bush - as a young man he chained himself to fences at nuclear facilities and is hard left.

He says that he is very distressed at the blame being heaped on the Feds including FEMA and the president. He says it takes several days to assess and get things together. Usually 3, but here the Tuesday flooding was followed within 2 days with massive Federal help. The devastated area is at least as big as Great Britain !!!!! Get a grip folks.

Point #2 National Guard troops don't sit around in barracks in their uniforms and their trucks packed and engines idling. They are citizens who have to be gathered from their homes, outfitted and sent on specific missions.

Point #3 Can you imagine the heaven and hell that had to be moved to find the fuel for all those busses, truck, helicopters, boats, etc. in a part of the country where the refineries were out of commission?

Point #4 All these folks who poured into the disaster areas had to bring their own food, water and housing. that could not be accomplished in the snap of the fingers.

Point #5 Ever heard of triage? Look it up. You save who you can. You have to categorize - those who can be on their own, those who can make it if you help them, and those who are not as likely to make it even if you give help. The Kansas City Star has an imbedded reporter with a Missouri Guard unit. Very enlightening. They got into a Catholic run nursing facility with a bunch of dead people and the rest being cared for by 2 nuns and a couple of aids. The ones who were taken out first were the ones who would likely survive the stress of being taken to the airport. The last ones to be taken were the weakest - and, in fact, several did not make it before they were done. Sometimes life is hard.

[Donald R. McClarey]

"They've shown, at least in this administration, that the poor, the ill, and the elderly, are indeed acceptable losses. I can't imagine their disaster scenarios for a terrorist hit stateside are played out otherwise. Morally, that's just unacceptable for a Christian."

Todd, what role did the federal government play in not utilizing hundreds of school buses left sitting in parking lots in the City of New Orleans? What arm of government had control of those buses? What arm of government had the addresses and phone numbers of the bus drivers?

[Julia]

One more thing: I have a friend in Slidell who I finally found thanks to a message board being maintained by the Times Picayune. Slidell was hit by the eye of the storm when it veered a bit to the East of NO.

Slidell has only lost a few people so far - even though it had a 15 - 20 ft water surge, 90% of its buildings had serious damage and 50% of the buildings are destroyed. There was a citizen program of calling directly by phone to convince people to leave. No government help until thursday and National Guard only now beginning to show up. It was local planning and civic cooperation that has made the difference.

I have been reading about the disputes between the academics & the Corps of Engineers. The LSU academics want to restore the barrier islands and re-silt the area South of New Orleans to the mouth of the Mississippi. Now silt from the river is channeled all the way out to the continental shelf and dropped over the edge into the abyss. The marshlands are quickly disappearing - less & less buffer for NO.

The Corps, on the other hand, want to strengthen and raise the levees and the situation will only get worse. Additionally, siphoning out water from New Orleans is causing the land to sink further and then the levees have to be built even higher.
Nothing will get accomplished until this dispute is resolved. Throwing money at NO before a sensible long-term solution is in place will lead to further chaos.

[amy]

Yes, Todd, do a rational analysis. What was the *local* emergency plan for which state and local officials were primarily responsible? What was their plan for evacuating the helpless? That's my question. And how did they - the ones responsible - carry it out? The Superdome was an acknowledged evacuation site in the plans - but it did not contain any supplies or provisions for getting them there.

You might take a look at this discussion forum for some interesting questions

[Phil]

Come on guys, can we ever go beyond our political partisanship? This is beyond Republicans and Democrats, conservatives and liberals. The tragedy caused by this act of God was inevitable, but the extent of the tragedy could have lessened considerably. It was so extensive because of poor leadership, poor planning and poor implementation. And much of what happened was indeed foreseeable (including the looting). But the lack of leadership falls on everyone, the federal government and local and state governments. Bush and Brown deserve severe criticism, but so do Blanco and the mayor of New Orleans (forgot how to spell his name), as well as many others along all the colors of our political spectrum.

[Donald R. McClarey]

Thank you Amy for that link! Those are very interesting questions for the mayor of NO.

Hear is my preliminary overview. The government of NO was worse than useless in the crisis. The main contribution of the mayor was in making hysterical and contradictory statements to the media rather than in taking any effective action to evacuate those remaining in NO. The police dept. of NO, with certain heroic exceptions, simply was missing in action in the troubled areas that needed an overwhelming police response. The governor of La, Blanco, seemed completely overwhelmed initially, and didn't activate the National Guard and send them in to NO nearly soon enough.

The feds, once they realized that both city and state governments were paralyzed, should have helicoptered in at least a token military force of two or three battalions on Tuesday. This may not have stopped the looting and the breakdown in law and order, but it should have been attempted. Too much deference was afforded to the local authorities early on, on Tuesday and early Wednesday, and in a crisis of this magnitude such constitutional niceties should not be allowed to compromise the safety of the public.

[Elizabeth]

"And really, I am left wondering if, in the realities of these plans, if those who can't self-evacuate are simply written off in the final calculation. Are they?"

I would hate to admit this as an American, but after watching this disaster unfold on TV I have a sickening gut feeling there is an unspoken attitude in our society that the poor, infirm, and, yes, even criminal element who disproportionately make up those who couldn't self evacuate are expendable people. No one SAYS it too loud or on comment boards, but I have heard a few people whispering over their watercoolers things that can be summed up by "well, most people who died were probably the ones keeping the city down...maybe it will good for rebuilding the city with those bad neighboorhoods gone...." always followed up with the save "of course, I feel SOOO bad for all those people who had to suffer..." Being from the Detroit area, it is not unlike the way-to-common comment out in the suburbs that a disaster would be "good" for Detroit...get the undesireables and crackhouses out of the way so we can rebuild. Yes, people REALLY do say things like that in the privacy of their own social circles, outside of the PC regulations of public discourse. A far cry from the Christian, and ideally, American, attitude where EVERY individual person, even those who are a "drag" on society, have a infinite worth and dignity.

And it was telling that when a bunch of white tourists were taken from the Hilton to the Superdome to get on the buses evacuating, they were moved to the front of line. No one expects wealthy or middle class tourists to have to suffer and wait with the masses. But the poor? They are used to suffering. They can "handle" it. They live in squalor everyday anyway.

I think the blame can go all around for general unpreparedness and incompetance; but I think that our society's subtle attitude that some people are worth less than others, are less deserving of comfort and dignity and more "used to" and tolerant of hardship, contributed to a lax attidude and delayed response towards those trapped by the storm. With a couple days notice, the city couldn't even commandeer a few extra porta-johns in the stadium or stock up on some water and extra trashbags??? Some basic basic supplies??? And, like has been said before, if Shepherd Smith, etc, can get in the city, with all of their cameras and news equipment why couldn't someone get in IMMEDIATELY to drop a load of water, diapers, trashbags, etc to the trapped refugees at Superdome after the winds had passed??? Its a combination of incompetant planning and inaction fueled by an indifferent attitude towards the suffering of the poor.

[Julia]

Check out the NYTimes article about New Orleans' finest - going to be taking vacations in Las Vegas at taxpayers' expense.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/05/national/natio
"And it was telling that when a bunch of white tourists were taken from the Hilton to the Superdome to get on the buses evacuating, they were moved to the front of line. No one expects wealthy or middle class tourists to have to suffer and wait with the masses. But the poor? They are used to suffering. They can "handle" it. They live in squalor everyday anyway."

Several hotels collected money from their guests and hired busses to come and get them. When the busses showed up, NO police commandeered them and diverted them to the dome. That's why these folks went to the front when eventually order was restored. These people had already paid for the busses several days earlier. These people were not locals. Other people paid to get out of town, what's wrong with white people doing it, too?

I
nalspecial/05vegas.html

[Julia]

Sorry, here's that link

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/05/national/nationalspecial/05vegas.html

Check out Amy's link to Loyola's Hurricane plan. Students are told that they are responsible for their own transport to an evacuation site. Nice, young, predominantly white middle and upper class white students being told they are on their own. Remember, we're talking about out of state students with no vehicles. The University explicitly states that it has no responsibility for getting the students out and that the City of New Orleans is not going to do it, either.

Drop the racist arguments.

[sj]

I would also point a finger at the prevailing attitude for the past thirty years to the effect that government can do no good and that government on all levels should be given as little as possible with which to do its job. That is, that it's much more important to cut taxes than to engage in any sort of community effort to organize in advance for possible disasters. New Orleans government, like local governments everywhere since the 1980s no doubt was under a lot of pressure to keep its tax rates and public expenditures as low as possible so as to "compete effectively" with other municipalities. This race to the bottom has helped lead us to where we are now.

As for anticipating looting behavior, at least in my city, some will start looting after a six inch snowfall. I had no trouble anticipating that a hurricane would bring it on.

[Mike L]

My first thought is that there are a lot of PR specialists out there trying to justify the governments response, and the obvious contraditions that I am hearing make me believe that at least some government agencies are lying to protect themselves. I don't like Bush, but the most honest statement, the response was not enough, seems to have come from him.

I have read that Amtrack offered to send trains into NO to help the evacutions, and FEMA said no. I have also heard that the Forest Service offered water tanker aircraft for suppressing the fires and were told no. I have read that relief convoys were waiting outside of NO to go in and were stopped by "the government." If even one of these is true, then grave injustice has been done.

I also agree that aid takes time, but for years now our tax dollars have been collected with the excuse that they are needed to make us safe. Now we are being told that we should be making our own plans for safety. Too often I have been told "let the professionals take care of it." I don't believe you can have it both ways.

Maybe the real fault lies in each of us for allowing the government to follow the course that it has, for not demanding that they live up to their promises, for allowing incompetant people to lead us.

[Daniel H. Conway]

This is a national disaster, not just a disaster for New Orleans. I will not give Bush a pass. He has chosen syncophants at every turn who cannot execute a plan or operation. He has done poorly in every crisis.

He planned poorly for Iraq, hasn't finished the job in Afghanistan, and had to wait 5 days to have his underlings begin an effective response to this multi-state emergency caused by Katrina, something which has been identified as one of the top three most likely disasters for which the nation should prepare. (The trend has been toward more hurricanes and more intense hurricanes.)

He chose these people to lead us, if they passed him bad info or performed poorly-such as Brown and Chertoff, that is his fault. If they failed at their task-he is ultimately responsible.

If his budget advisors led him to suggest that it is wiser to give tax cuts to every family in America (so they could buy more what? Xboxes, Gameboys?) as oppose to shore up defenses for the closer to real and less proverbial "rainy day," that is ultimately his fault.

He failed at business and fails at running every operation except political campaigns. He chooses operational personnel poorly and should be asking folks to tender resignations at the end of this crisis.

Who were the heroes-the much defiled MSM who showed that-yes I can get into New Orleans, I can jsut drive there. I also appreciate Harry Connick, Jr who made it into the New Orleans Convetion Center before FEMA Director Brown could even verify that people were there. Actually, if not for these folks, this crisis would have continued.

If only the Bush administration showed as much guts as the MSM, or an overrated jazz musician.

[Boniface McInnes]

"Maybe the real fault lies in each of us for allowing the government to follow the course that it has, for not demanding that they live up to their promises..."

Or maybe even for falling for promises on which no one can reasonably deliver.

[Elizabeth]

Julia,

That does change that particular story a lot. I was not aware those tourists paid for the buses. Thank you for the correction.

However, even the few tourists who got stuck in the superdome for a couple of days were treated specially by the national guard; they were given food rather than having to wait in lines, they were given special instructions to protect themselves, and generally watched out for. I don;t object to people being protected from thugs; but my question is, were the police and the guard going around to all the poor black single moms and families and making sure they were safe and giving them warnings to huddle, or were they left to fend for themselves against what was assumed to be "their own"? (the news story is linked to on DRUDGE).

And as for the students, yes, the university is not helping them, but most of them have connections, concerned parents, resources, and a network to help them get out. I assume the VAST majority of those kids have a bank account, a cellphone, knew someone on campus with a car, or had parents who drove down to come get them out. They had on themselves or knew someone with the resources to get out and shack up in a hotel until mom and dad came to bring them home. Most of the people who ended up at the Superdome and Convention Center don't even have a bank account, many don't know ANYONE who owns a car, and many have never even left the city of New Orleans in their lives. The university knows its students have the means to get out. No one assumed they would be stranded. Read the interviews with evacuated students; their biggest worry is what new school are their going to transfer to. When you find a story about stranded students, let me know. What I am talking about is the totally lax attitude towards helping the poorest and the weakest, those with no way out, the most desperate people Christ calls us to help in their time of need.

Why is it SO HARD for people to even admit that racism MIGHT still exist in this country? Not to get off topic...but everyone knows who Natalie Holloway, Chandra Levy, and Elizabeth Smart are...but where was the media frenzy about the preganant black woman who was missing in Philly and the thousands like her every year? Why do wealthy tourists get handed rations and instructions to huddle while poor families with babies have to wait in line and take their chances with the hoodlums? I'm sorry, but I grew up with that same, "racism is dead" mindset until I actually left my white rural bubble and got to know a lot of black people and the crap they deal with. And its not just a race thing, its a class, appearance, general perception that some people are worth more than others. On one level, there is a nasty part of me that is reassured by the stories of the tourists getting help and special treatment; I KNOW that if I had been there, some national guardsman would have taken my cute little middle-class white Irish self under his wing. I've been the beneficiary of better than others treatment my whole life. I never get traffic tickets, there is always a Mister Chivalrous guy to walk me home at night, and people generally open doors and give me the benefit of the doubt and make exceptions for my comfort. My black roommate had a TOTALLY different experience of life; and that is WRONG. It may be a natural thing to treat some people better than others and to care more about the welfare of those more like us but the Gospel calls us to rise above that; the dignity and safety of a poor black single mom with four kids is every bit as important as the virginal white tourist. The loss of that girl in Philadelphia is every bit as tragic and sad as Natalie Holloway or Terri Schiavo in God's eyes. It makes my stomach turn, on a Catholic discussion board, to hear that there are actually people who harbor attitudes that are more in line with political conservatism than the Catholic Gospel. Racism, and generally looking at some people as more worthy of dignity than others is not just something that "liberals" make a fuss about; it is a sin, a degradation of human dignity, and it is just as grevious as gay marraige and abortion and all of those other things that so many people who confuse American Conservatism and Catholic Orthodoxy condem.

The irony is that, in a parallel tragedy almost 100 years ago on the Titanic, it was the mostly Catholic immigrants in third class who were the trapped and "expendable" people. My great-great aunt was in third class and her story isn't much different from that of many of the poorest survivors of this tragedy. Back then Irish Catholics were the hooligans, the criminals, the starving "its their fault they are so primitive and can't take care of themselves" expendibles of society. The more things change the more they stay the same.

[Elizabeth]

SJ,

I agree with your point about the "government can do no right" attitude. There are somethings that only the government, which exists for the common good, CAN do. It is a shame that there is such a strong element in this country that puts the emphasis on "less government" rather than "better government".

[Julia]

NYTimes editorial 13 April 2005:

Anyone who cares about responsible budgeting and the health of America's rivers and wetlands should pay attention to a bill now before the Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works. The bill would shovel $17 billion at the Army Corps of Engineers for flood control and other water-related projects -- this at a time when President Bush is asking for major cuts in Medicaid and other important domestic programs. Among these projects is a $2.7 billion boondoggle on the Mississippi River that has twice flunked inspection by the National Academy of Sciences.

The Government Accountability Office and other watchdogs accuse the corps of routinely inflating the economic benefits of its projects. And environmentalists blame it for turning free-flowing rivers into lifeless canals and destroying millions of acres of wetlands -- usually in the name of flood control and navigation but mostly to satisfy Congress's appetite for pork.

This is a bad piece of legislati

[Julia]

For Elizabeth:

Stranded college student story

http://www.freep.com/news/nw/kxavier2e_20050902.htm

BTW, those busses that picked up tourists, they had been paid for and entered New Orleans on Wednesday and were commandeered by the NO police to the SuperDome at that time. It was several days later that the tourists were lead out to board different busses that you saw on TV on Friday or maybe Thursday.

[ml]

Elizabeth:

Here is a story about those international tourists in the Superdome:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,11069-1765482,00.html

“The army told us to stick in a group and for the women to sit in the middle with the men around the outside and to be ready to defend ourselves,” Mr Nelson, from Epsom, Surrey, said. “Their urgency scared us. I sat on the outside, really scared by this point, sitting waiting for God knows what. We waited and waited, I didn’t sleep. A lot of the girls had been groped.”

Miss Wheeldon, from Carmarthen, South Wales, said that being inside the Superdome was terrifying and that she had been sexually harassed.

“The atmosphere was extremely intimidating,” the Lancaster University student said. “People stared at us all the time and men would come up to me and stroke my stomach and bottom. They would also say horrible, suggestive things. The worst time came when there was a rumour that a white man had raped a black woman. We were scared that we would be raped, robbed, or both. People were arguing, fighting and being arrested all the time.”

The “internationals”, as the army labelled the stranded tourists, were among the few white people in the stadium. Marked out by their skin colour and unfamiliar accents, they were verbally abused, while their luggage made them targets for robbery.

Mr Nelson said that local people also noticed that they received preferential treatment from the guards who gave them ration packs and water to help them to avoid food queues.

Mr Nelson, who graduated from Loughborough University in June, said: “The queues for the rations got more and more crazy. People were desperate.

“The physical conditions were horrible. It was stiflingly hot, you were sweating constantly. The smell was awful, a mix of sweat, faeces, urine — just a horrible, horrible smell.

“When the water stopped and the toilets packed up, it just got worse and worse. I can still smell it; it makes me gag.”

Miss Wheeldon said: “The sights we saw you wouldn’t want anyone to see. The filth and smell were unbelievable.” The threat came from a minor-ity — mainly young men. “The majority of the people of New Orleans are absolutely lovely,” she said. “Some families were ready to give us their food even though they had nothing.”

One of the most dangerous periods came on Wednesday when the military decided that the internationals should be removed for their own safety.

Officers told them to organise themselves in groups of five and make their way to an exit. The leaders were given a blue wristband and made accountable for the others. Mr Nelson’s was still on his arm yesterday.

He said: “The people around us were suspicious and resentful. They asked where we were going and we lied. We said that we were going to sit somewhere else. I walked off, head down, tunnel vision, I didn’t stop to think. I felt guilty but there was also a tremendous sense of relief that I was getting out of there.”

The tourists were taken to an emergency medical centre where many volunteered to help. “There were very few medics and we were able to help with feeding people, carrying stretchers and just talking to people who had lost their whole lives,” said Mr Nelson. “That night we saw a soldier brought in from the dome who had been shot in the leg.”

[Donna]

Elizabeth: The Gulf Coast population is predominately white so this isn't just a "black" tragedy, although the focus on NO makes it seem so.

Besides the elected officials of NO are mainly black. They are now playing the race card to cover their own incompetence and dishonesty. (A tactic I remember well from my years in DC during the Marion Barry administration.) Race doesn't explain why school buses which could have been used to transport thousands of people out the city sat idle until they were unusable.

I grew up with that same, "racism is dead" mindset until I actually left my white rural bubble and got to know a lot of black people and the crap they deal with.

Many black people I know will be the first to tell you that much of the crap inner-city blacks have to deal with comes from other blacks - single motherhood, fatherless boys who grow up with a gangsta mentality, the attitude that studying and aspiring is "a white thing," and speaking standard English means you're an "Oreo." I have a young black co-worker, an ambitious woman and a fine employee, who told me her efforts to get an education were mocked every step of the way by other family members who called her " a house slave." (Luckily for her, her mother was very supportive.)

Racism still exists, yes. But I simply do not believe it is a defining factor in American life these days, which is what race-baiters want you to think.

[Katherine]

Are y'all familiar with the study showing that all other qualifications being equal, a black job applicant with no criminal record has a worse shot at getting hired than a white job applicant with a criminal conviction? Here's a link to the paper and here is a summary of it.

I think that the proximate cause here was class, not race, but it is not a coincidence that so many of the poor are also black.

[Katherine]

This is what Barack Obama had to say:

Obama sees the deplorable situation of the impoverished marooned in the flooded city more in terms of class rather than race. The federal, state and local response did not fail because New Orleans is "disproportionally black," Obama said.

"I think there were a set of assumptions made by federal officials that people would hop in their SUVs, and top off with a $100 tank of gas and [get some] Poland Spring water," and flee the storm, Obama said.

The tragedy, said Obama, revealed "how little inner-city African Americans have to fall back on. But that has been true for decades."

What I've learned about covering Obama, a freshman senator, is that he is very measured.

On Friday night, rapper Kanye West, during a hurricane relief concert, said, "George Bush doesn't care about black people."

I asked Obama if he agreed.

"What I think is that we as a society and this administration in particular have not been willing to make sacrifices or shape an agenda to help low-income people," he said.

[Andrea Harris]

People. New Orleans was a majority (about two thirds) black city. There were plenty of white locals among those 20% who did not leave the city; let's say about a quarter to two thirds. (I could be wrong, this is just my impression from watching the extremely skewed coverage on tv.) So of the 80% of the population that got out, I guess, like the population of the city, a majority of those were... black.

Quit playing the race card. No one is denying that there is racism in this country; as long as there are human beings there will be prejudice for one dumb reason or another. What is ridiculous is to hysterically assert that some sort of conspiracy by the federal government exists to "write off" poor black people and let them drown. The people in the city of New Orleans were failed by their black mayor, their majority black police department, the thugs and gangs of whatever race that ran about raping and pillaging and shooting at rescuers, and their female state governor. But okay, all this is solely the fault of Bad Daddy Bush, who didn't send in the marines, even though there are two other states that have been stomped flat that need just as much help picking up the pieces as Louisiana does, because he doesn't care about black people.

[Donald R. McClarey]

"What I think is that we as a society and this administration in particular have not been willing to make sacrifices or shape an agenda to help low-income people," he said."

Let's see now, 10 billion, initially in federal funds for hurricane relief, most of it going to NO, a city 70% black. The largest military relief effort in our history. Volunteers and money pouring in from around the nation. Texas taking in 250,000 from La. States, communities, churches, corporations, charities and individuals all eager to help. Yep, we obviously just don't care about poor people, especially poor black people.

[Elizabeth]

I don't think race is the defining factor either...but I think it is a contributing one. And it not just racism; it is more an attitude of indifference to the poor, elderly, and less fortunate in general, and that goes way beyond racism. Heck, I wouldn't be suprised in an emergency situation if a pretty, young, wealthy white girl recieved help quicker than an overwieght, haggard, middle aged, poor white woman, the type of people who are so often referred to as "trailer trash". Its not just race, its just the general tendancy for people to subconciously treat some as more worthy than others, that happened in this tragedy, and it is totally anathama to Christian and American ideals of equality and the dignity of the person.

This tragedy has had multiple levels of failure and incompetence; bad coordination, a corrupt local government, incompetant people on all levels, a city that is already ridden with crime and poverty even before the tragedy, etc etc. But I was just addressing the question of whether or not, in event of an emergency, some people were considered expendable. And I think the answer is "yes", there are people our society considers expendable, whether we admit it or not. It is not just a racial issue, included in that catagory of "expendable" people are the poor, the old, etc etc. And I think it is largely a subconsious attitude that affects the intensity of the response rather than an explicit policy of "we aren't going to help people who are poor/black/old/sick or all of the above." It is an attitude, that plays itself out on little small levels, like the situation at the Superdome, where certain people are given more help than others. It is played out by the local government who, regardless of the racial aspect, failed to take care of their most vulnerable citizens...and for them to just use the "race card" is, I agree, wrong and a cop-out. I am not saying that race was the defining factor in this tragedy or an excuse for anyone. But this tragedy did expose a certain blase attitude towards the less fortunate in society and an attitude that some people are more worth saving than others, a problem of which race was one of many factors. Innocent Blacks who are being terrorized by other blacks deserve the same protection as whites who are being terrorized, and as far as I was reading, that just wasn't happening there. But there are also stories of elderly people who were told help was coming and it never came, etc, etc. Same disease, varying symptoms. And yes, racism is a word that gets thrown around a little too casually nowdays and used as an excuse all the time, but the other extreme, saying it just doesn't exist and the knee-jerk reaction to always dismiss racism found in certain corners of our society are equally wrong. I think it aches the American psyche to admit that we still actually have such things as racism and third world conditions in our own cities, on American soil, and it is a problem whose fault lies with "liberals" and "conservatives" alike and the constant extremes of race-baiting and excuse making (the poor absolutely can't help themselves at all) or denials that racism or real poverty exists at all (and if it does, its totally the poor's fault, let them deal with it). The real heart of the problem is an insufficient appreciatation for the infinite dignity of EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING, which should transcend "liberal" and "conservative" philosophies. It is unfortunate when Catholics think with minds shaped more by the American political landscape than the Church; ie. liberal Catholics who make excuses for Abortion and homosexuality and conservative Catholics who deny racism exists or deny that government is capable of being reformed to do any good in a tragedy.

ml: that is the story I read.

[Donna]

Obama forgot to mention this:

"The Drudge Report features this, from the Louisiana disaster plan, pg 13, para 5 , dated 01/00:

‘The primary means of hurricane evacuation will be personal vehicles. School and municipal buses, government-owned vehicles and vehicles provided by volunteer agencies may be used to provide transportation for individuals who lack transportation and require assistance in evacuating‘…"

250 buses, which could have transported 30,000 people out of town in 2 trips, are sitting uselessly in flooded parking lots in NO. That couldn't be because local officals screwed up royally and didn't execute their own plan. No, it's because the administration doesn't care about poor black people.

[Katherine]

you guys seem to be arguing against people and arguments not made in this thread.

[Elizabeth]

also, (slightly off topic) it makes me crazy that, in our current climate of discourse in this country, if you say something which even begins to go against the "conservative" line, you are a race-baiter, Bush hater, Jesus hater etc etc, or if (in other parts of this society, not this blog) you say something against the "liberal" line, you hate poor people and are a religious nut. I voted for Bush twice, the second time with reservations, but voted for him nonetheless. I was at the convention, in the room, clapping and cheering for him when he was nominated in 2000. As a teacher in an inner city Catholic School, I'd had the race card played on me. Not a fun experience to try to give detention to the daughter of the local NAACP president, let me tell you. But saying Bush was incompetant (which I didn't but others did...and it is a reasonable point), or acknowladging that just MAYBE we still have a race/class problem in this country isn't "laying all the blame at Big-Daddy Bush" or saying there is a government conspiracy against black people. Stop thinking and reacting in "liberal"/"conservative" ideological extremes.

There is fault, incompentance, and social ills on all sides and at every level and nothing in this country is going to get done until both sides start admitting that they share the blame and get cracking together on solutions. That goes for this tragedy, which was in the making long before the storm hit, and every other societal ill in which liberals and conservatives eat each other over with rhetoric and suspicion without ever actually "solving" any problems. The victims of this storm are not only victims of mother nature but of the general dysfunction of our government, ideological battles, finger pointing, indifference to human dignity and equality, crime, and original sin in general which still marrs our society whether we would like to admit it or not.

[Donna]

Katerine: People make arguments. They don't simply waft down from on high. You presented Obama's argument and I noted that Obama, in his desire to blame "society" and the Bush administration, overlooks the errors made at the state and local level.

I am not saying that there were no mistakes made at the federal level. But NO, and Louisiana, have been corruptly and incompetently led for decades. It's no wonder that they were unable to cope with disaster, and also not unexpected that they are now pointing fingers at the Feds and sprouting silly conspiracy theories to cover their derrieres. I was going to say that it is a surprise that so many people outside of the afflicted area are possessed by such hatred of Bush that they are willing to give the local officals a pass and defend their race-baiting and conspiracy theories - but actually, it's not very surprising at all.

[Donna]

A comment from a poster on LGF, who has been in the thick of things on the Mississippi coast:

I just wanted to pass along my little prespective from the front in Mississippi. My power has just returned ,..., the MSM's handling of this crisis has been even worse than I could have imagined. It is being framed as a racist conspiracy, and proof that racism is as bad as ever in the U.S., but the truth is quite different. An AP reporter - a raging liberal, btw - whose wife was staying in the same friends' home as my family and me this week, says that AP won't let him tell many of the stories he witnessed first hand, among them that when predominantly black refugees from New Orleans were piled together with predominantly white tourists who were evicted from their hotels inside the convention center, there were packs of black drug gangs preying on the tourists. A NYT reporter who tried to enter the CC was beaten by them and thrown out. At one point a police commander came out of the CC and announced that his officers were organizing a military-style invasion to retake the place. As the reporter was leaving the Superdome, he and a few fellow reporters were followed by a few blacks for a couple of hundred yards, who taunted them saying, "It's the fault of you JEWS. You JEWS living up in the Garden District drinking wine and champagne while we die down here... it's all the fault of you JEWS."

Is this a racial catastrophe? Only in the sense that it's a cultural catastrophe the short end of which many blacks in New Orleans have put themselves on. Look at the difference in the situation on the Ms. Gulf Goast vs. N.O., and you'll see the difference made by a culture of dependency vs. a culture of independence: The scope and intensity of the destruction on the coast dwarfed what happened in N.O., but how much of the sick depravity that happened in N.O. happened on the coast? Damned little. The explanation can be found in what will become the enduring image from this disaster: A lone black woman, sobbing, holding and dragging multiple children to what she hopes will be deliverance. Meanwhile on the Ms. Gulf Coast, if you actually go down there instead of watching the TV news, the enduring image is of FAMILIES - led by MEN - rolling up their sleeves and getting after it. All they want from the government is to keep out the troublemakers - they'll take care of the rest. In New Orleans, a disturbing number of the "men" who are left are brutalizing and preying upon people. Not so on the Ms. coast. The utopia the liberals keep telling us is there - one in which life is not just bearable but equally idyllic without responsible men being around and intact families being in place, is a fantasy, and there's no better proof than the contrast you seen in New Orleans vs. the coast.

Now, that lone black lady dragging her children deserves all the help and prayers we can give her. But it's naive to think that the social pathologies which made NO such a dangerous city prior to the hurricane had nothing to do with what occurred afterward.

Did the government - at all levels - simply give up on these people? That's a question we'll be finding out in the weeks and months to come. What seems heartbreakingly apparent is that a certain percentage of NO's population simply gave up on themselves - long before Katrina hit.

[Rick]

But it's naive to think that the social pathologies which made NO such a dangerous city prior to the hurricane had nothing to do with what occurred afterward.

Powerful post, Donna.

It's worth recalling that attacks on rescuers, such as firemen, is not unknown in other cities. Theodore Dalyrymple wrote a powerful piece on such attacks in the cites of Paris:

"When agents of official France come to the cités, the residents attack them...Antagonism toward the police might appear understandable, but the conduct of the young inhabitants of the cités toward the firemen who come to rescue them from the fires that they have themselves started gives a dismaying glimpse into the depth of their hatred for mainstream society. They greet the admirable firemen (whose motto is Sauver ou périr, save or perish) with Molotov cocktails and hails of stones when they arrive on their mission of mercy, so that armored vehicles frequently have to protect the fire engines."

The truth is that in many of our cities there has grown up, as Dalyrymple says, "a kind of anti-society." In these "no-go zones" the rule of law is tenuous at best; police, firefighters, and even mail carriers often do not dare to venture in.

Katrina has taught us how dangerous the practice of ignoring the residents of no go zones (including the many victimized and innocent ones) can be.

[ml]

Elizabeth:

The extra attention the foreign tourists received at the Superdome does not strike me as unwarranted. If virtually all the 10,000+ people in the dome were white except for a small number of blacks, and an aggressive minority of those whites were gangs of skinheads with no respect for fellow whites and particular contempt for the blacks, it would be equally appropriate to keep the blacks in one area, take measures to protect them from harm, and move them along when order was at a breaking point. And that would go doubly true if the blacks were from foreign countries whose consulates were calling Washington to ask for help and protection for their nationals.

Those foreign tourists were not the only whites in the Superdome, and I have not read anywhere that the New Orleanian whites in there were given special treatment. It was the foreign tourists who were protected. And I heard that Mayor Nagin had personally involved himself in the evacuation of those tourists ahead of the locals in the Superdome. It may not be fair, but there were practical reasons: the tourists didn’t need to go to Texas shelters; they did need to be dispersed over the globe. At some point, they were going to be separated from the locals and taken in different directions. Maybe for simplicity’s sake, it was better to get them out of the way so that everyone left would be on the same page.

And I'm sure there was a harsher practicality behind the evacuations of tourists before locals. New Orleans makes about 5-6 billion annually from tourism, and the hope is that the tourists will return once the city is habitable again. Americans are wary of traveling to France because waiters are rude to them; imagine the damage to New Orleans if tourists return home having been raped or beaten or killed by the locals for no other reason than that they are tourists who can afford a New Orleans vacation.

[michigancatholic]

By now, if you guys are reading the news online, you know that there's been a lot of friction between the federal government and the governor of LA. The federal government has been obstructed in starting work, not only by the disorder, but by the lack of communication and co-operation from the governor's office. She's causing as much ruckus as she can. It's so obvious, biased old CNN can't even cover it up.

[michigancatholic]

You guys are the ones talking race. To even point out differences makes you a racist by definition. Give it up. You're no better than the ones you're trying to vilify.

[Chris]

If I had a dime for every northerner I've seen in the last week spouting off on how to conduct hurricane relief, I'd be one rich Floridian. Please, step away from the keyboard before you hurt someone.

[Chris]

Sorry mc. You posted while I was typing, and that wasn't meant to be directed at you - at least not specifically.

It's just that it's clear that so many people who have an opinion about this situation have never been through a hurricane at all, much less one properly managed. If it weren't for the seriousness of the situation, we in Florida would be falling on the floor laughing at all sides of this.

Yes, FEMA can be slow - but they aren't meant to be first responders. Yes, people sometimes refuse to evacuate - but that's their choice, and they have to live with it. Yes, some people can't evacuate (for a whole host of reasons) - but a good disaster plan will factor things like that into the mix so people aren't left in the jam the New Orleanians were.

There's blame all around, but it seems to me that the more likely someone is to blame for something, the more likely you are going to find him pointing a finger at someone for something else.