« Casey at CUA | Main | And in case you've forgotten »

September 15, 2006

Oh, please

Raise your hand if you're tired of Muslim "outrage."

First, in case you're very late to the party, here is the English text, from the Vatican website, of the Pope's address to the faculty at the Univeristy of Regensburg.

(Here are texts of most of the other talks for the trip, in English, German and Italian.)

We've been talking about this talk in a couple of blog posts over the past week (scroll down for that), but now the global conversation is heating up.

In Turkey, comparisons to Hitler:

Kapusuz told the state-owned Anatolia news agency that Benedict’s remarks looked “like an effort to revive the mentality of the Crusades”.

“Benedict, the author of such unfortunate and insolent remarks is going down in history for his words. However ... he is going down in history in the same category as leaders such as Hitler and Mussolini,” he said.

Pakistan's parliament unanimously condemns the Pope:

Pakistan's parliament on Friday unanimously adopted a resolution condemning Pope Benedict XVI for making what it called "derogatory" comments about Islam, and seeking an apology from him for hurting the sentiments of Muslims.

The resolution, moved by hardline lawmaker Fazal Karim, was supported by both government and opposition lawmakers in the National Assembly or lower house of parliament.

Chaudhry Ameer Hussain, speaker of the National Assembly, allowed Karim to move the resolution after Karim said the pope had insulted Islam and the Prophet Muhammad, and hurt the sentiments of the entire Muslim world by making "derogatory remarks."

A reminder of how the Pope spoke of Islam in the speech:

was reminded of all this recently, when I read the edition by Professor Theodore Khoury (Münster) of part of the dialogue carried on - perhaps in 1391 in the winter barracks near Ankara - by the erudite Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologus and an educated Persian on the subject of Christianity and Islam, and the truth of both. It was presumably the emperor himself who set down this dialogue, during the siege of Constantinople between 1394 and 1402; and this would explain why his arguments are given in greater detail than those of his Persian interlocutor. The dialogue ranges widely over the structures of faith contained in the Bible and in the Qur'an, and deals especially with the image of God and of man, while necessarily returning repeatedly to the relationship between - as they were called - three "Laws" or "rules of life": the Old Testament, the New Testament and the Qur'an. It is not my intention to discuss this question in the present lecture; here I would like to discuss only one point - itself rather marginal to the dialogue as a whole - which, in the context of the issue of "faith and reason", I found interesting and which can serve as the starting-point for my reflections on this issue.

In the seventh conversation (*4V8,>4H - controversy) edited by Professor Khoury, the emperor touches on the theme of the holy war. The emperor must have known that surah 2, 256 reads: "There is no compulsion in religion". According to the experts, this is one of the suras of the early period, when Mohammed was still powerless and under threat. But naturally the emperor also knew the instructions, developed later and recorded in the Qur'an, concerning holy war. Without descending to details, such as the difference in treatment accorded to those who have the "Book" and the "infidels", he addresses his interlocutor with a startling brusqueness on the central question about the relationship between religion and violence in general, saying: "Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached". The emperor, after having expressed himself so forcefully, goes on to explain in detail the reasons why spreading the faith through violence is something unreasonable. Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul. "God", he says, "is not pleased by blood - and not acting reasonably (F×< 8`(T) is contrary to God's nature. Faith is born of the soul, not the body. Whoever would lead someone to faith needs the ability to speak well and to reason properly, without violence and threats... To convince a reasonable soul, one does not need a strong arm, or weapons of any kind, or any other means of threatening a person with death...".

The decisive statement in this argument against violent conversion is this: not to act in accordance with reason is contrary to God's nature. The editor, Theodore Khoury, observes: For the emperor, as a Byzantine shaped by Greek philosophy, this statement is self-evident. But for Muslim teaching, God is absolutely transcendent. His will is not bound up with any of our categories, even that of rationality. Here Khoury quotes a work of the noted French Islamist R. Arnaldez, who points out that Ibn Hazn went so far as to state that God is not bound even by his own word, and that nothing would oblige him to reveal the truth to us. Were it God's will, we would even have to practise idolatry.

As Professor Bainbridge noted yesterday, the speech was, of course, much broader than Islam, and took many contemporary intellectual assumptions to task, essentially asking wheter real, substantive dialogue is possible in a world untethered from Logos.

But what of his words on Islam? I have maintained that it wasn't an idle historical reference. It was a challenge - on the level of an intellectual query - to the assumptions driving much of contemporary Islam. Violence, jihad, hatred of non-Muslims, and a restriction of their rights to worship in Muslim countries are inarguably elements of contemporary Islam to varying extents, in various parts of the globe. Six hundred years ago, this came up in a dialogue - the answer pointed to a dilemma: the Muslim said that God was greater than any of his own precepts.

The question becomes then - what basis for "dialogue" can there be in this context?

Just as, the Pope proceeds to ask, what basis for dialogue can there be in the modern world when religious questions and sensibilities are deleted from the discussion even before we start? 

Since there are, indeed, many ways of thinking under the umbrella of "Islam" and there is no central magisterium, we always issue caveats about proclaiming what Islam teaches or the way of Islam in the modern world. But I think it's safe to say that the drumbeat is getting terrifically tedious. It's the drumbeat of constant offense coupled with a Muslim world in which Christians and Jews and the West in general are vilified, in which, for the most part in Muslim states, there is either very little or no freedom of religion for non-Muslims or the threat of violence by Muslims against non-Muslims, in which the most destructive acts of terror are committed explictly in the name of Allah - they are offended?

The Pope held up an interesting question for us to contemplate: Who is God? How can we talk about God?  What does God's existence and nature then imply about the way human beings are to live together on this planet? When true reason is abandoned as an attribute and expression of God, what hope is there for dialogue and peace?

The "Muslim" response to the Pope ironically and unwittingly answers his question, don't you think?

Posted by Amy Welborn | Permalink

Comments

How DARE you suggest that Islam has preached violence. The Qur'an tells us that we should KILL you for saying such things!

Posted by: Chris S. at Sep 15, 2006 9:58:51 AM

Talk about making dialogue impossible. If a statement such as this cannot be made then what can be said? I hope the pope does not back down and stop talking abut Islam at all. He may end up a martyr but the church needs martyrs a lot more than it needs politically correct speech.

Posted by: Randy at Sep 15, 2006 9:59:26 AM

I'm raising my hand and rolling my eyes.

Posted by: Jeannette at Sep 15, 2006 10:07:24 AM

They do it because it works, as "right-thinking" Westerners and their leaders generally fall over themselves to apologize. During the cartoons fracas, French grocer Carrefour (sp.) proudly displayed signs announcing a boycott of Danish food. They may be "foaming Bronze Age fanatics" on one level, but they are keen students of the modern grievance culture on another.

Posted by: Rich Leonardi at Sep 15, 2006 10:07:56 AM

May I raise both hands and be counted twice?

Well, let us give thanks to God. "Blessed are you when men revile you and curse you because of me."

Every one of these outrageous condemnations is a blessing from the true and living God. May Benedict feel their consolations and gain strength from them.

Posted by: Naomi at Sep 15, 2006 10:12:38 AM

The outrage expressed from the usual suspects demonstrates their intolerance, exceeded only by their predictablility. More interesting will be the reaction of the Orthodox, to both the general theme of the talk, as well as the allusion to their most dire historical era and the principled position they maintained.

Posted by: TRD at Sep 15, 2006 10:27:21 AM

I am raising both hands...

I am soooo over it...

Posted by: Chris at Sep 15, 2006 10:31:47 AM

I noticed that the "outraged" Turk didn't mention the priests recently killed in Turkey or the priest stabbled in Kassel, Germany just the other day, all by young Turks.

Islam, the religion of peace and submission. What they don't tell you is that it is "us" who are required to submit.

Actually it is probably smart from a personal point of view that Muslim officials don't mention such things because they probably would be killed themselves within a week if they dared criticize a jihadist.

For a long time I have been praying daily for the Pope's health and intentions. I recently have added his "safety" to my prayers.

Posted by: Ray from MN at Sep 15, 2006 11:13:14 AM

My personal favorite is "It looks like an effort to revive the mentality of the Crusades." That's right baby! I say - "Bring it on!"

Ironic as well - on Fox news, where I read the report, right next to the story are these headlines:
- Iraqi Authorities Find 30 Bodies in Baghdad
- Attacks on Yemen Oil Plants Kill 5 Days After Zawahiri Threatens Region
- NATO Renews Call for More Troops for Afghanistan
- Gunmen Kill Five Security Officers in Gaza
- Possible Airline Bomb-Plot Material Found in U.K.

Hmm - no violence in the Middle East to be found here!

Posted by: Mikaela D'Eigh at Sep 15, 2006 11:19:58 AM

Here's my favorite quote from a recent news article:

"Anyone who describes Islam as a religion as intolerance encourages violence," Pakistan's Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Tasnim Aslam said.

Um....

Do you know what you just said?

Posted by: Tom at Sep 15, 2006 11:21:36 AM

Amy interjects...
=
Oh, please
Raise your hand if you're tired of Muslim "outrage."
=

How about two hands?

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n83/saintcrown/HandsUpPope.jpg

Posted by: Fr. Stephanos, O.S.B. at Sep 15, 2006 11:53:14 AM

But I think it's safe to say that the drumbeat is getting terrifically tedious. It's the drumbeat of constant offense coupled with a Muslim world in which Christians and Jews and the West in general are vilified, in which, for the most part in Muslim states, there is either very little or no freedom of religion for non-Muslims or the threat of violence by Muslims against non-Muslims, in which the most destructive acts of terror are committed explictly in the name of Allah - they are offended?

I must say, as a true liberal, I agree with Amy's comment here. The paradox here is that these Muslim critics of the Pope are once again demanding tolerance of intolerance.

Posted by: Jimmy Huck at Sep 15, 2006 12:10:56 PM

Jimmy, "Tolerance" ALWAYS means The Other Guy Has To "Be Tolerant" Of ME (i.e. always let me have My Own Way), NEVER the other way around.

Any six-year-old can tell you that.

Posted by: Ken at Sep 15, 2006 1:26:25 PM

Along with the apparent "these guys can't read," "pawns of the mullah," and "terminally touchy takers of offense," is the possible "consolidate support from anti-Catholic Westerners."

To my newly-in-full-communion Orthodox ears, the Pope's speech is gorgeously subtly clear & brilliant, and heartwarming. Especial prayers for him attending Divine Liturgy on November 30.

Posted by: dilys at Sep 15, 2006 3:21:55 PM

Mikaela D'Eigh said: "My personal favorite is 'It looks like an effort to revive the mentality of the Crusades.'"

I second that.

My only hope is that the current brouhaha will give rise to a renewed discussion of what the Crusades were all about.

I pray my hope is not in vain.

A man can only take so much of the incessant claptrap about Christian "wars of aggression" before a desire to respond in high dudgeon shifts to sheer boredom.

Posted by: John Jansen at Sep 15, 2006 3:41:32 PM

"Just as, the Pope proceeds to ask, what basis for dialogue can there be in the modern world when religious questions and sensibilities are deleted from the discussion even before we start?"

Very smart! I think you got an important point here: what the Pope is looking for is a REAL dialogue, one that discusses of reasons, of understandings and insghts: what do you understand of reality when you are a muslim or an agnostic? Confront seriously on this!
For years we were plagued by an empty "dialogue" glossing over the problems of truth, meaning, morality and hiding the contents of faith because they objectively disturb. I'm so tired of words exalting a fictional togetherness unsubstantiated by any reason that's not "feelings"!

What the Pope fears, I think, is that we are going inexorably towards a climate where we have on one side a large portion (not a minority, in my opinion)of Muslims who take for granted their faith just because it defines their identity, an identity you can't even try to question as it *coincides* with the will of God: in the Gospel people ask questions to Jesus and He tries to guide them to an insight and a decision; in the Koran you have a list of rules and from pure obedience you have salvation. You don't seek a firm but deeper understanding in the Koran, but a practical guide coupled with the assuration that you are right.

On the other side we have a prosperous West, disenchanted about the very possibility of any truth but fearful to lose his good standing if he implicate too much in dubious issues: much better to shut both eyes and ears and pretend to be righteous with the choice to never choose and with the false humility which thinks it's impossible to think.

Posted by: Paolo at Sep 15, 2006 4:03:55 PM

Now only if President Bush had views on Islam like the Pope's then hatred by Muslims toward the US would dwindle -
OOPS! never mind.....

Posted by: Mark Wyzalek at Sep 15, 2006 6:01:33 PM

I just read the whole address. Wow. Seems to me he could have launched his talk with the same historical anecdote about the emperor, but left out the part of the quote about Muhammad, and it wouldn't have lost any of its persuasiveness. That said, the (over)reaction is ridiculous. I'm afraid the subtleties in this address could never be grasped by those now protesting it.

Posted by: DumbOx81 at Sep 15, 2006 10:32:18 PM

I raise both hands, and my feet.... I am soooo tired of these fragile sensibilities..

Its allrite for all of them to become enraged by a highly academic theological discussion which nowhere states that the pope himself supports what the 14th century (!!! lets not forget that part too!!!) Emperor said, and then to burn images of the pope.

Can you imagine the reaction in the world if images of an Imam where to burnt ?
How come you don't see highly catholic nations like brazil, spain or even italy for that matter riot ?


Posted by: Jip at Sep 18, 2006 7:51:33 AM

I am a Catholic, but always felt the S. Huntington's theory of "Clash of Civilizations" is rather shallow and improbable. At best it is only wishful thinking by those who stoodd to gain by such conflicts. I also think the wars in Iraq and Afganistan are ill-advised and ill-conceived and have caused untold sufferings to innocent men, women and children.

But the Holy Father's speech addressed a genuine issue which we civilized human beings face in the present world, i.e., religious violence. The violent reaction to the speech rather justified the need to address the genuine questions raised by the Holy Father. Our Muslim brothren should understand that such violent reactions have the negative result of hardening the attitudes of even neutral, liberal individuals like me. Now I feel I feel less sympathy.. because after all I am, we are human..

Posted by: edenwoods at Sep 19, 2006 3:00:17 AM

Post a comment